Masa (Journey) is a new Israeli state project which aims to fight assimilation by harassing and kidnapping young cross-pollinating diaspora Jews and sending them off to be ranted at by furious Israeli bobbes. Masa’s advert is being screened in Israel, here’s the translation:
More than 50% of young Jews abroad assimilate (mitbolelim) and we are losing them.
Do you know a young Jew abroad?
Call the Masa project and together we will strengthen his connection to Israel so that he won’t be lost to us.
Masa. A year in Israel, love for life.
Is Masa the equivalent of a Jewish Crimewatch? One things for certain, Jews are still way ahead of the game when it comes to innovations in the art of matchmaking – and guilt giving.
A Jewish Crimewatch? I don’t think so. More like a Jewish Nazi party. If I was a bit younger I’d go out right now and miscegenate.
hi alta, interesting story. What is marrying out? To ‘marry out’, one has to have been ‘in’. You have to ask yourself ‘what am I in?’. You don’t subscribe to the doctrine, you don’t wear the uniform, you don’t observe the ritual etc yet you’re still ‘in’. How does this come about? Cos your mam is ‘in’ so you are ‘in’. When you are born, you are free, free until those already here decide you’re not with a ritual or two. Its said by many that jews are no different than everyone else. How would being a jew make you any different? Why is it so important for those already here to psycologically separate you from the rest to the point of deciding who your gonna love and spend your life with. You may decide to have children, but then those already here make their intentions known, insisting on ‘the ritual’. You’re now in the big dilema, if refuse the label and ritual it will be the biggest insult ever to those who love you – talk about guilt trip! To me the question is why bother being or calling yourself a jew, it just seems like a lot of hassle over nothing. Calling yourself jewish is no gaurentee of being right, far from it (israel etc). The jewish people I know seem to have an extra burden to carry through life, why? What have they done wrong? They are unhappy deep down, struggling with some unfathomable puzzle about having to live up to being born ‘different’ from others. As an outsider it is upsetting to see young jewish people struggling with a forced mantle. I watched some orthodox kids repeating their conditioning on ‘goyim’ and it was truly sad, cos underneath the hat and ridiculous haircut one could see they didn’t understand what they were doing.
Look, this isn’t a big anti jew rant, I just find it difficult to get the ‘jew gang’ thing. Why bother calling yourself a jew with all that it entails just for the sake of it. Jew is just a label you choose, its not set in stone, marry who you want, love them and love yourself.
I would be very interested in reading views of ex-jews and how/if they feel after their liberation. Thankyou
Hi alta, apologies, just re-read me post and by the end of it realised I was sort of unintentionally hi-jacking your thread, soz.
Hi Robert,
I think the reason that no-one has yet responded is that this is a big topic you’ve waded into, and one thats perhaps a little more complex than you suggest.
To start with, I don’t know anyone who calls themself an ‘ex jew’ (though we’d like to hear from any out there!) For many Jews, the ethnic element is sufficiently strong to consider to call themselves Jewish, despite not engaging in any practices. This could be seen as someone from America calling themself an American despite have lived in Britain most of their lives.
To simplify rather a lot there a few main groups amongst those who self-define as Jewish.
1) Those for whom it is purely an ethnic label, who they are by both. Analogous with being Polish, French etc.
2) Those for who it is both an ethnicity and a religion, who practice the vast amount of ritual practices, learning, prayer etc that Judaism, like Christianity, Islam etc., demands.
3) Those for whom it is a religion and not an ethnicity, ie those that have converted to Judaism (more people do this than you might think).
4) Those who don’t fall into these groups, whose Judaism is more than just ethnic, but who wouldn’t call themselves religious. This is a large and diverse group, and might include people who identify with Jewish culture, history, ethics, music, food, political tradition etc.
So that’s a simplified, but reasonable explanation.
To try and answer some of your questions, it is not that Jews are born ‘different’ it is that everyone is born different. There is no ‘universal human’ from which others are a deviation. You will also have a ethnicity, a language, cultural traditions. I don’t know you, but there’s a fair chance that you are English speaking, British born, of Christian ancestry. You may be born ‘free’ but you are also born into a particular culture and surroundings. How you choose to describe yourself is up to you, but I won’t criticise you either way. I wouldn’t tell you to abandon your culture, so I don’t think you can tell me to abandon mine.
You say that calling yourself a Jew seems like a big hassle over nothing. I, and the other Jewdas writers, really don’t think so. We may call for radical, free-thinking, and open Judaism, but it seems to me that to demand that one group/culture should give up their identity and practices is not a progressive or radical idea at all.
thats all I’ll say for now, happy to respond if you want to come back on this.
Hi Baruch, thankyou for replying. Yeah, after reading your post it got me thinking that if what you said is correct, then the whole jewish issue (for want of a better description) is well complex and confusing, not only to non jews but also the jews themselves. The range of how involved, in everything jewish, that one could immerse themselves is huge. One could be an orphan whose mother was jewish, born in northern Britain,never been in a synagogue,doesn’t speak Yiddish/Hebrew, gone to a catholic school and never seen, let alone eaten a bagel, yet call themself a jew – to being brought up the full monty orthodox, akin to rabbi Jackie Mason who descibed himself on his show as’ The Ultimate Jew ‘.As you said ‘the ethnic element is sufficiently strong enough’ but what does that mean? Ethnicity is comprised of a number of factors and yes, you can convert to judaism but that doesn’t make you ethically jewish. A vast number of religious jews are not semitic,hebrew is not their first language, don’t live in the middle east and are not racially related to moses etc. As you used the example of Americans, I’d like to use the example of christians. Christians can be any race,speak any language and live in any country,yet they are not of the same ethnicity – they are all different but agree to roughly beleive in the same story, a story based on faith rather than fact -very similar to the jewish belief, both sharing similar origin but with different interpretation.It seems from your 4 descriptive examples that there is no hard and fast rule to being a jew as even identifying with the culture, music,food, history, ethics and political tradition is enough to proclaim jewishness – all of which could be down to a ‘phase’ or ‘fad’ one was going through.
As to the ‘Jewdas writers’ view of being radical and progressive, the question of ‘liberal reform’ comes up. You guessed correctly,Im an english speaking, christian/catholic raised, born in britain. But for over 25 years have rejected the british culture and have strongly reject the christian/catholic patriarchal sexist belief system and believe in its abolishment.I do not agree with reforming such an institution and therefore would be regarded as radical. Is this (no offence) wishy washy anything goes as long as you call yourself a jew, nothing more than liberal reformism? Where does your ‘radical progressive’ fit into the description you gave of being jewish? These patriarchal belief systems are self evident in their origin – torah,bible,vatican,israel. You have every right to criticise my views and I have every right to defend them. A label I would choose would be anarchist, as its starting point says we are equal but not the same and we all go forward together, not a label that says we are ‘chosen’ ‘sinners’ ‘victims’ ‘blessed’ ‘persecuted’. These terms are divisive.Ethnicity is divisive,would I be wrong to say that most if not all Jewdas writers are british born,white,english speaking, jews? No offence intended but so what,our common bond is our privilage.Privilage born out of a british colonial past, the forcing of our language on our conquests, our religious bloodletting (yes, the jewish peoples also have much blood on their hands) why would a radical progressive want to align themselves with such patriarchal shenanigans? As many of us have different sized feet,it can be difficult to walk in others sandals so to speak, but there’s always the option of going barefoot. Ok, I sincerely haven’t set out to insult anybody at Jewdas or elsewhere,so thanks for reading and look forward to your thoughts.
Fuggit – if a Jewish lassie ‘marries out’ – the kids are still Jewish, so where’s the problem? There are still the same number of Jewish kids as if she married a Jewish bloke.
Robert,
Right, where to start. Well lets just say that like many before me – the Anarcho-Communist Chernoe-Znamia (the first major anarchist movement of Russia, almost completely Jewish) , the Jewish Anarchist Federation of the East End, those around the Fraye Arbete Shtimer of NY and much much more – I consider myself a Jewish Anarchist. The other Jewdas writers, I presume as I don’t know everyone, associate themselves also with this rich radical jewish cultural history or with others – The Jewish Labour Bund, radical rabbis, Jewish feminist movements, and on and on. Nothing about being a Jewish anarchist is a ‘fad’ other than, I should hope, the ignorance of the wider anarchist movement today to accepting that fact. Jews, self-defined and not, have been the backbone of many of the ninteenth and twentieth centuries radical movements, anarchist especially.
Maybe that sounds surprising since many of todays radical movements are covered in a white-atheist blanket where it becomes problematic to vocalise difference. This tendency, I would argue, is why most anarchists come from such simmilar backgrounds. Where are the people of colour in the anarchist movement of the heavily multicultural UK? Well, you’re proposing exactly one reason why large swathes of society have no interest in the idea: because they cherish their cultural identities and don’t see anything progressive in abandoning them for some abstract conformist revolution. Accept it, you’re proposing a political ideal based on the values of white atheist Brits, and we don’t all want to look like white atheist Brits.
Regarding your comment that “the jewish peoples also have much blood on their hands”, please provide a single example. Yes, the state of Israel is covered in blood, but The Jewish People? I’m sorry, but if you are going to talk about the entire Jewish civilisation then you can’t group them all in behind a single state which has existed for little over fifty years and which the majority of Jews in the world neither live in nor hardly fight for. Jewish people have commited religious bloodletting. Hmm. Actually, I would argue that Jews have not spilled a single drop of blood in the name of religion for almost two thousand years. Jews of the diaspora and their religion have always been some of the most peaceful on the planet. Please prove me wrong.
You say that you have no interest in reforming/revolutionising Catholocism or other creeds you were brought up with so therfore we shouldn’t be interested in reforming/revolutionising ours. Isn’t that just a tiny bit arrogant? Hello, what about the world not revolving around your kop?
To make the point, which actually has nothing to do with the point of this post but nevermind, you say ‘ethnicity is divisive’, i say a movement can only be radical when it cherishes peoples’ differences; ethnic or otherwise.
Colin,
Yeah, but its not as easy for the guy, hey? Sure the child of a Jewish mother gains official acceptance but not of the father. I think this is a particularly horrid aspect of mainstream Jewish law. Why oh why is this the case?
Hi alto, thanks for your points. Please remember I’m just trying to understand the issue and Im not trying to piss you off. Just because alot of people who identify with judaism call themselves anarchists doesnt mean there arent going to be contradictions that create uneasyness in some non-jewish anarchists.
I think the ‘blanket’ over the movement is, as you describe white, but I would include middle class,which I think would be more accurate – a white, middle class, blanket.With regard to your analogy as to why people of colour are not forthcoming in joining the anarchist movement, it is for them to give their reasons, have you tried asking?
There is/was no proposal by me for a ‘white athiest Brit’ political ideal, where did I say that? Why did you say that?
Yes, the comment of ” jewish peoples…blood on their hands” was and I accept clumsily expressed, what I meant was there are plenty of jewish people who have been involved in and engaged in bloodlust killings and still are to this day in ‘defence’ of their beliefs let alone the cruel animal treatment endured in kosher factories. (http://www.goveg.com/feat/AgriProcessors/)
Your comment about ”the world not revolving about my kop” sounds alittle funny coming from someone who supports a belief/faith that through the judaic/christian/muslim route has a strangle hold on over half the worlds population – so its ok for the world to revolve around the judaic kop?
‘Ethnicity is devisive’ – it is the radical stances against accepted cultural inequalities that upset the ones who do very well off the back of those inequalities, generally the males. Much ethnic practice throughout the world is based on oppression, and many radical progessive groups are identifying this. Talk of culture and ethnicity is often used to gloss over unfair,sexist, patriarchal communities, here and world wide.
Cheers
I think you’ll find, robert red, that these things ARE set in stone: http://www.prozacville.co.uk/2007/11/how-jdate-works.html
Ha ha very funny Prozacville. Visited your site, well good. Yeah would you say you may, contrary to what Baruch says, be a candidate for, wait for it – the first ‘ex jew’. Imagine the first ‘ex-J-Date’ site, has a certain ring to it, a new word even! Going by the comments section the odds would be vastly improved of meeting an independant thinking equal on the love boat of life.There are, it seems alot of disgruntled jews about, maybe just waiting for a nudge to jump ship, and sail off to anywhere they choose but the illusive promised land. On a more serious note, the comment about ”Born Jew crowd” -by Debora and the hierarchy attached, lends itself to the point about divisive ethnicity. Anyway yer post made me laugh as I was feeling I was up against the proverbial wall with my clumsy questionings. Bon voyage
Fuggit – if a Jewish lassie ‘marries out’ – the kids are still Jewish, so where’s the problem? There are still the same number of Jewish kids as if she married a Jewish bloke.
hi alta, just been flicking through some threads and ended up on the channel 4 news page. Anyway, I found this short film about an english lass, Shira Gilad, who is carrying out the theme of your post to the letter. At 3.30 in the film a guy is mentioned called Meir David Kahane(on the flag) who, after reading about on wiki, it said ” Kahane’s legislative proposals focused on revoking the Israeli citizenship for non-Jews and banning Jewish-Gentile marriages and sexual relations”. The write up goes on to say he wasn’t supported by the knessnet and was banned. Maybe they just didn’t want to publicly agree with him at the time. Her views on the clip seem a bit wild and dilusional, do you agree and if you do why do you think that? I would be very interested to know. The link is this: http://www.channel4.com/news/articles/world/middle_east/the+west+bankaposs+english+settler/3322007